Comments on: Politics of fear, politics of hope, politics of sand http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-politics-of-fear-the-politics-of-hope-the-politics-of-the-sand/ The Marketplace of Ideas Sun, 19 May 2013 14:04:05 +0300 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.5.1 By: Yonatan Knickerbocker http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-politics-of-fear-the-politics-of-hope-the-politics-of-the-sand/#comment-94072 Yonatan Knickerbocker Mon, 07 Jan 2013 20:31:27 +0000 http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/?p=89950#comment-94072 First, let me apologize for my earlier poor post. You put a lot of effort and thought into your post and I shouldn't have responded the way that I did.

The basics of what I was trying to convey still hold true though. Although you take a nuanced approach, you still arrive at the same end point as all those that hold onto the peace process as our only hope in surviving.

To acknowledge that there really is no chance for a true peace, yet to push anyhow for such a peace flies in the face of reality, especially since many risks have already been undertaken and failed miserably. I understand that you say it is for our own good and that is where there is partial merit in what you write, however, this is not a civil case where one party will be enriched and the other won't. Most times in life are better served by your approach, but we are dealing with a group of people that want us gone, preferably dead. You cannot deal beneficently with such a reality, you have to face it with the seriousness that they face you with. It is your responsibility to do so, anything less is derelict on your part.

]]> By: Marc Schulman http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-politics-of-fear-the-politics-of-hope-the-politics-of-the-sand/#comment-94074 Marc Schulman Mon, 07 Jan 2013 19:11:30 +0000 http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/?p=89950#comment-94074 I wish I could answer that question, but I have not been able to

]]> By: Elizabeth Ehrlich http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-politics-of-fear-the-politics-of-hope-the-politics-of-the-sand/#comment-84302 Elizabeth Ehrlich Mon, 07 Jan 2013 15:01:23 +0000 http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/?p=89950#comment-84302 Good speech, but can you imagine any Israeli giving it? Where (background, party, experience) would such a politician come from? And why is this the case?

]]> By: Marc Schulman http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-politics-of-fear-the-politics-of-hope-the-politics-of-the-sand/#comment-84310 Marc Schulman Tue, 01 Jan 2013 21:38:14 +0000 http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/?p=89950#comment-84310 What did I say that you disagree with. Where in the world did I say they will act in a certain way, if anything the article was about how skeptical I am of their willingness to agree to peace

]]> By: Yonatan Knickerbocker http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-politics-of-fear-the-politics-of-hope-the-politics-of-the-sand/#comment-84300 Yonatan Knickerbocker Tue, 01 Jan 2013 03:09:29 +0000 http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/?p=89950#comment-84300 I'm sorry, I had to stop reading your diatribe before I reached the end. You cannot continue to posit that the other side in this conflict will act in a way that you want just because it is logical. You say you want to have realism, yet you ignore every opportunity to be real when it is presented to you on a silver platter.

We want peace, but wanting it is not enough. We have worked for peace, but that is not enough either. You cannot will your way if the other does not ultimately want and value what you do. Keep ignoring this reality at your own peril.

]]> By: Ilan Toren http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-politics-of-fear-the-politics-of-hope-the-politics-of-the-sand/#comment-84308 Ilan Toren Mon, 31 Dec 2012 21:00:48 +0000 http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/?p=89950#comment-84308 Certainly Livni is the politics of hope. She hopes that there are enough voters who can't remember that she is relentless opportunist with no ideas or ideology that she will make it into the next Knesset

]]> By: Shlomo Toren http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-politics-of-fear-the-politics-of-hope-the-politics-of-the-sand/#comment-84306 Shlomo Toren Mon, 31 Dec 2012 18:42:18 +0000 http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/?p=89950#comment-84306 Livni is selling "the Hope of Livni". Peace is just a marketing ploy. So is the BIBI WARMONGEER.

To say the Right is selling the politics of fear is also incorrect IMO. The Right, by and large is optimistic about Israel and her abilities and therefore not afraid of the Arabs, the EU and especially not the UN. The premise isn't so far fetched when we all see the Arab world collapsing on itself, Europe with 15% unemployment and the UN reduced to a bad joke. Meanwhile Israel has a fairly vibrant economy and things are pretty good…… at least for now (and who can tell about tomorrow).

Of course definitions of who is mired in Fear and who inspried by Hope are very fluid. "Hope" is the new soap, and is just marketed the same way.

]]> By: Amy Erani http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-politics-of-fear-the-politics-of-hope-the-politics-of-the-sand/#comment-84298 Amy Erani Mon, 31 Dec 2012 17:15:50 +0000 http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/?p=89950#comment-84298 Great job on a clear analysis of where we stand, as the clock ticks toward our next election –-
Along with a plaintiff plea for the sake of our souls, and our children).

]]> By: Marc Schulman http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-politics-of-fear-the-politics-of-hope-the-politics-of-the-sand/#comment-84304 Marc Schulman Mon, 31 Dec 2012 17:00:06 +0000 http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/?p=89950#comment-84304 That depends on where you are starting-Livni tries to sell the "hope of peace". If you believe in Eretz Yisrael Hashalem, then you can be hopeful about Habeyet Hayehudi, if you do not believe in that message then their platform does not have a hopeful message.

]]> By: Shlomo Toren http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-politics-of-fear-the-politics-of-hope-the-politics-of-the-sand/#comment-84294 Shlomo Toren Mon, 31 Dec 2012 16:49:32 +0000 http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/?p=89950#comment-84294 You must be joking when you attribute to Livni "the Politics of Hope". All of Livni's campaign is negative and dire prophecies of what will happen to Israel if Netanyahu continues as PM. If anything Bennet is about as positive as you get this campaign, which is probably why his support has soared.

If I were in Likud Beitenu I'd be working overtime to get out the vote. As it is, there is little reason for anyone not on the the Right to be enthusiastic and if the Right gets out the vote , then they not only will win, but win big time. And that is what I call "the politics of hope".

]]> By: Shlomo Toren http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-politics-of-fear-the-politics-of-hope-the-politics-of-the-sand/#comment-84296 Shlomo Toren Mon, 31 Dec 2012 16:49:32 +0000 http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/?p=89950#comment-84296 You must be joking when you attribute to Livni "the Politics of Hope". All of Livni's campaign is negative and dire prophecies of what will happen to Israel if Netanyahu continues as PM. If anything Bennet is about as positive as you get this campaign, which is probably why his support has soared.

If I were in Likud Beitenu I'd be working overtime to get out the vote. As it is, there is little reason for anyone not on the the Right to be enthusiastic and if the Right gets out the vote , then they not only will win, but win big time. And that is what I call "the politics of hope".

]]> By: John Yorke http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-politics-of-fear-the-politics-of-hope-the-politics-of-the-sand/#comment-81262 John Yorke Mon, 31 Dec 2012 15:31:46 +0000 http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/?p=89950#comment-81262 Admirable sentiments and all three positions as stated, fear, hope and sand , are undeniably present in the minds of the Israeli voting public. But sentiment and words will not be sufficient to sway the bulk of the general populace in this matter. Only a comprehensive plan, fully addressing all the points raised, will stand any chance of meeting with wholesale electoral approval.

Fear.
Http://yorketowers.blogspot.com

This does not remove fear but, instead, changes the source from whence it springs. Under such an arrangement, fear of the traditional 'foe' is transferred and becomes resident among Israelis themselves. They are changed into their own potential enemy and are now more worried about what damage they might do than just about anything else. The odds must be, therefore, that they will do nothing to harm their cause or their country. And doing nothing is a form of peace. And, if both sides are so minded, the basis of a real peace becomes viable, almost predetermined.

Hope.
Http://yorketowers.blogspot.com

The hope is that the containment of violence, the lessening of fear offered by this plan will allow negotiations and decisions to take place in a far less fragile environment. Peace would then become the expectation rather than just the dream.

Sand.
http://yorketowers.blogspot.com

As you yourself have said, 'Together there may be a small chance that we will bring about peace in this land. Though in the event that we fail, we will know it will not be for lack of trying.'

Try this approach and see what happens. Then at least you can never doubt that every avenue was explored and all possible remedies were applied.

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