The Nazis in Latin America (Part I)

Interview with Pablo Weschler
Over the years, after the Second World War, the Holocaust, and all the barbarism that humanity had experienced, a group of men, led by their leader Adolph Hitler, had to face the defeat of a regime they believed would last 1000 years, and which they had called the Third Reich. Nazi Germany, but not only that, Nazi Europe, had been devastated by the triumph of their enemies the Allies. Especially by Russia, but later by the United States, Britain and France as well. Hitler’s whereabouts were always a mystery, as it was said that he committed suicide with his wife Eva Braun, just before the Russians entered Berlin.
The fate of Hitler, who surely already knew that the largely suicidal war to which he had led Germany and all her allies, whether by conviction or compulsion, was a catastrophe for them, is uncertain.
In addition to Hitler, the entire Nazi leadership, the scientists who designed so many weapons, even in a very short range of time, sought the annihilation of all who were against their ideology.
Before they had to turn themselves in and end up at the Nuremberg Trials or commit suicide even in front of their captors, as in the case of Heinrich Himmler, Hitler’s second in command, some decided that the smartest thing to do would be to flee to a place where they were not known and there clandestinely continue their lives. The most common destinations were in America, from the northern hemisphere to the most remote place in the south, Patagonia.
David A. Rosenthal: Why make a documentary about Nazis in South America?
Pablo Weschler.: First, I think it is a global issue. When one mentions Nazism, World War II, Hitler, Nazism in general, it turns out that it is not only an issue, let’s say, of Jews being victims of Nazism or of Germans in the past or of Austrians, let’s say, or European countries in general, but that the issue continues to be relevant at all levels.
Oppenheimer’s film, for example, which was released a few months ago, was a huge success in all the cinemas of the world. Bibliographies of Stalin, Churchill, Hitler are sold at all the world’s fairs today, and have been for the last 10 years. The subject of the Second World War is still vital and of interest to many, many millions of people.
Books are translated into Chinese, Russian, Spanish, English, of course. It is a very important and curious topic, interesting to millions and millions of people on all continents. I, too, then, was drawn to it on a personal level.
My father’s side was killed in Poland during the war, so I was very interested in the subject of Nazism. I wanted to know what happened, what year it was, where it happened, what happened to them. In general, the Jewish people, apart from those who come from the Ashkenazi side, those who lived in Europe during the war, surely almost the majority had some kind of knowledge, or know of a relative who died in the war, so, on a personal level, I am very interested in the subject.
And besides, as an Argentine, knowing that I lived in Argentina at the same time as the Nazis who escaped to Argentina, that also caught my attention. So, I also wanted to cover this topic by talking about the escape of the Nazis from Europe to Argentina starting in 1945, which was the year the war ended.
DAR: Now, how reliable are the materials, sources and testimonies that were used for the documentary?
PW: Well, it is a good question because first I base myself on the CIA reports from that year, from the year 1945, from 1946-1947, where they are writing that very important, heavyweight Nazis, Nazi leaders, escaped from Europe and arrived in Argentina. There are not one or two, I am talking about myself, I have seen and read eight reports from 1945 to 1948, in which they report that Nazis are circling Argentina, submarine caravans arrive in southern Argentina, on the Atlantic coast, in places like Necochea or south of Mar del Plata, which is the southern Atlantic zone of Argentina, and there are contacts between, on the one hand, the Argentine army that is waiting on the beach with trucks and Nazis, of course, and on the other hand, self-sinking of German submarines close by, a few kilometers from the coast, boats that come out of these submarines that are sunk and very large numbers of people and also wooden boxes arrive in boats, the question is, what did they bring, what was inside, of course, and who were these people who were constantly coming down, by the dozens, from the submarines that were arriving on the Argentine coast. It means, if the Argentine army is on the coast, that there is a kind of agreement, arrangement, accord between both sides.
That is on the side of the American reports that I was able to receive. On the other hand, I base myself on Patrick Burnside’s book, Hitler’s Escape, from 1999, in the first edition that was published, in which Patrick did a thorough job in southern Argentina, investigating the subject of the German community in southern Argentina, especially, and he had many reports and many sources and witnesses who really know a lot about the subject. We must also take into account the book The Authentic Odessa by Uki Goni, also a very well-known writer, both in Europe and in Argentina.
They provide many reports, photos and unique materials explaining the agreement and treaty that existed between the Nazis and, especially, detailing more and giving a lot of information about the contact that existed between the Nazis in Argentina and the former president of Argentina in 1945, Juan Domingo Perón and his wife Eva Duarte Perón, better known as Evita.
This couple, together with the Nazis of Argentina, did a very important job so that these German Nazis could escape from Europe and arrive clandestinely to Argentina, receive new identities there, they and their families, and live peacefully the rest of their days on Argentine soil without any problem, because they were protected by the wings of Juan Perón in those years.
DAR: How would this change history if it were confirmed, if it were proven?
PW: Well, we are now talking about Adolf Hitler. What happened? The official version says that Hitler committed suicide in the bunker in Germany, in Berlin, and that part of his skull is in the Kremlin safe in Moscow.
Years ago, anthropologists from the University of Kentucky in the United States were able to obtain a small part of the brain from this skull that was there, in the Kremlin safe, and they were able to take it to Kentucky to do a laboratory test, to see what happens with the DNA, whether it really belongs to Adolf Hitler or not. The result was absolute and no, it is negative. What they have in the Kremlin are not remains of Hitler’s skull, but of another person.
The question then is, what happened to Adolf Hitler? What was the whereabouts of the Nazi leader? When the official version says that he committed suicide, then other people say that they saw him in southern Argentina. More than seven people saw him as direct witnesses, who saw Hitler from 45 onwards. And there are others, of course, who as third parties know of stories that they saw Hitler, always in three main areas.
In the province of Córdoba, he was in the area of La Falda. He was in the province of Río Negro, in the valley, in southern Argentina, and of course in Bariloche and the area of Villa Langostura. We have many sources from people who saw him there. American reports are also based on the fact that Hitler was in those three areas.
DAR: So the question is what happened to Hitler?
PW: So he arrived in Argentina with these famous submarine caravans in Argentina in July 45, according to what we have in terms of American information. What happened then from the moment he landed on Argentine soil onwards? Where did he die and where is his body? That is the big question, because I am 100% convinced that this person, this mass murderer, died in Argentina.
I have no doubt about it. I spoke with direct witnesses who saw Hitler. I spoke with a waitress at the Hotel Eden, in the province of Córdoba, in the city of La Falda, where she herself served Hitler personally, during the three days he was at the Hotel Eden.
There are other cases of direct witnesses in Mar del Plata, and most of them are concentrated, as I told you, in the south of Argentina, in the city of Bariloche, in the area of Bariloche, Villa Langostura, in Río Negro, in the province of Río Negro. There was a very large community of Germans and Hitler was also around there, calmly, without any problems, of course with security, but he himself felt very safe in Argentina and without any problems. Just like Eichmann, Mengele, Barbie and others escaped.
DAR: And on that note, why South America?
PW: There are also traces of them being in Brazil, Bolivia, Paraguay, Uruguay, maybe also in Colombia and perhaps Chile, etc. Why South America? And well, in this case of the investigation specifically Argentina, why there and not somewhere else? It is very easy to explain. We know that those who wanted to escape from Europe used two means, either the church in Genoa in Italy or the Red Cross that was going around all of Europe.
Apart from Argentina, I had an apartment, a salvation office, that’s what it was called, in the city of Bern, Switzerland. There, any German Nazi could easily receive an open passport, a blank Argentine passport, by arriving at the office and arriving in Argentina with a new identity. Him and his family.
We know then that, on the one hand, they arrived through the Red Cross, as I told you, the Church, and they arrived in Argentina without any problem. Why Argentina? Because Argentina offered these 9.000 blank passports and the question is what did Argentina, Juan Perón and Eva Perón, receive in return to give this number of blank passports. There was a barter here, so the question is what was given, as a counterweight, to the Argentine passports that were given.
Then the majority arrived, these 9.000 Germans came to Argentina and felt very safe from 1945, when Perón was president, until 1955.
DAR: What happened in 1955?
PW: Perón is overthrown and leaves Argentina. So what happens? All the Germans who were in Argentina feel unprotected, their father has left them, they feel a certain insecurity in 55 and they start to go to different places.
Some of them went to the south of Brazil, some went to Colombia, Chile, some went to Bolivia and some to Colombia. They dispersed throughout South America, that is what is known. Some stayed in Argentina, they had no problems, their families had already settled there and they stayed in the south of Argentina. There were also German leaders who stayed in the south of Argentina, especially in the Bariloche area. But that is how things turned out. Perón offered them a new home.
DAR: Why Argentina?
PW: Because it was a safe place for them, there was a very well-established German community in Argentina, there were 900 German companies working in all fields of finance, banking, agriculture, companies like Siemens, Mercedes-Benz, Bayer, AEG, they were all working in Argentina. The German community was completely adapted to Argentina and they had a lot of strength and they felt safe and had very good ties. There was a connection between the German community and the Argentine government, so they felt very well and very close.
Already at the beginning of the century before the Second World War, Germany saw Argentina, southern Chile and southern Argentina, Patagonia, as a natural place where Germany, the great Germany, could continue to grow. Since they were limited in terms of territory within Europe, they wanted to make Argentine soil and Chilean soil, their south, Patagonia as it is called, a natural continuation of the land of Germany. Mother Germany could continue its natural growth in southern Argentina and southern Chile.
DAR: And what was in the Argentine?
PW: Apart from the natives, there were many Germans, Austrians, Belgians and Swiss who, of course, except the Belgians, all spoke German and still felt and saw Germany as their home. It is true that they were living 10.000 kilometres away from home, but they still felt Argentine, Chilean or German. So all these conditions served to make the Germans, especially in southern Argentina, feel very much at home and very close to the German homeland.
Of course, once the war began, they identified with all the values and with the whole struggle of the Germans against France and against England and, of course, against Soviet communism. So, it was something, a natural process that happened over the years. As I tell you again, from the beginning of the century, they wanted to bring together southern Argentina, southern Chile and Germany.
And those who knew about this, that is, except for that same German community and the people close to Perón, I am talking about the people, the Argentine civilians who had nothing to do with this exile.